The Woman King director explains why facts mattered in her action epic

Gina Prince Bythewood describes how she got to where she is today The Queen of Women as a “sustained fight for 25 years.” But she says with ThisViola Davis leads the cast. ThisMovie, Braveheart-esque historical action drama about female warriors in West Africa … the sustained fight was worth it.

“It’s an amazing thing to fight as hard as one has to fight for your vision,” she tells Polygon just two days before the film’s release.

Prince-Bythewood, who came up in television in the early ’90s, broke out as a writer-director with the 2000 indie Love & Basketball. But while she seemed to be on the familiar Sundance-hit-to-superhero-movie director pipeline, Love & Basketball’s success opened the door to an industry that still couldn’t imagine a Black woman making any high-profile studio project, let alone four-quadrant-friendly action blockbusters. Prince-Bythewood went from TV to feature films over the next two decades, working on projects such as Beyond the Lights and TV’s Shoots firedAs she hoped to finally break some screen bones, The chance finally came with 2020’s full-bore action drama The Old Guard, which caught the attention of Netflix viewers everywhere — and Viola Davis. To star as producer and director The Queen of WomenDavis was certain that Prince-Bythewood had the right person to produce a movie in which the audience could see the human side of the film. FencesOscar-winner smashed brutes twice her height into insignificance Director was delighted to oblige.

The Queen of WomenStars Davis as Nanisca (John Boyega), a defender for the Dahomey Kingdom under King Ghezo. Nanisca, a general in the Agojie is a all-women army faction that trains for Spartan like deadliness. Nanisca is responsible for preparing her soldiers for battle, particularly the deadly Izogie, loyal Amenza, Sheila Atim, and Nawi (Thuso Mbedu), who were enslaved by the Oyo Empire. The stakes and scope gave Prince-Bythewood the canvas she’s been waiting to paint for two and a half decades.

In a deep-dive interview with Polygon, Prince-Bythewood talks about the rigorous fight training required to build a worthy screen army, how the Agojie’s real-life history energized the action, and what it meant to bring Black actors to screen this way, arguably for the first time.

Image: Sony Pictures

Do you begin with actual-world history to provide a foundation for setpieces or do you go with action and then verify your decisions?

When I go see a historical epic, for me as a filmmaker and as me as the audience, I’m looking at that screen and taking it as truth. And I probably shouldn’t do that as much, knowing what people do. However BraveheartIt is one of my favorite movies. I’ve watched it 100 times. This was the real template. Dana wrote a really great script. [Stevens], and then it’s my job as the director to do that deep dive into the research. It was so exciting to find out that I could then incorporate it into the script. More truth, more authenticity of who these women were, who the kingdom was, that dynamic, socially and in the government, and what was going on the outskirts of that — a big David-vs.-Goliath conflict versus the Oyo. This will be taken as the truth by many, so I tried to include as much truth as possible. It was also a more compelling story because of the truth.

What’s a specific way history amplified your vision?

There were some things. One of the fascinating things about these women is that they legit beat men — so how did they do that? It was interesting to learn about their training and how they worked 24/7. They were also taught not to show any pain. To do this, they had to practice drills. Think about if you’re fighting someone, you’re stabbing them, they’re showing nothing, and how intimidating that can be. So that’s where our spear-challenge scene came from. And when you’re working with Lashana, she inspires you. You want to give her more and more and more, because she’s fucking amazing.

And then the music and the dancing, learning that that was an integral part of the culture as well, where they would create these elaborate choreographed dances and songs to get ready for war, and to celebrate the king, celebrate each other — adding that to the script was exciting. I didn’t know going in that I would get to play with that.

Image: Sony Pictures

What amount of contemporary dance was involved in these scenes? The moves sometimes feel like modern stepping.

It is truly historical. A lot of the work they accomplished has been preserved for future generations. We found this clip of descendants of the women performing traditional dances in 1960s. The choreography included a lot of aggression. This includes the cutting and stabbing. The choreographers were able take a variety of moves and add dance to round it out.

How did you meet Terence Blanchard? This sound, which is loud and powerful, speaks volumes without the need for dialogue in scenes.

As soon as Terence was offered the job, I knew immediately that I wanted him to be my partner. He’s absolutely brilliant. We wanted Terence mixed with an African singer to sing the songs. So we hired Lebo M., who’s well-known for his talents. The Lion KingMost famously. The conversations about what it should be were fascinating. The goal was to make an orchestral score with African instruments that has a traditional feel but still retains a cultural touch. Voice is another thing I like. It can convey emotion when used correctly. It sounded great, but was it possible to do this?

Because Scotland was the only country in the world with an orchestra, I locked the film literally a few days prior to my trip to Scotland. Everything seemed so urgent. The score was only like 75% finished, that’s how rushed it was. But Terence has said that orchestra was the best he’s ever worked with in his career, so everything happened for a reason. He would literally hand music off to somebody, they got the notes and ran it to the orchestra, and then they’re playing it. It was four days of energy.

These songs convey so many things without having to be translated into English. Is it possible to not communicate actual lyrics?

That decision was made very quickly. We were going accent English, I was certain. [for the dialogue in the film]I did, however, still desired an element of the actual language in it. So how could we do that in a way that doesn’t take you out of it? And I thought in the chanting and the songs, we could do it… which meant the actors had to learn all that on top of everything!

In the battle dance, what she’s saying is, “Fear not. Facing it head-on. Relentlessly we will fight.” Obviously, we say that in English twice. The tribute to the King is about glorifying King Ghezo. “When we are here to give her life and to fight for a human, for our kingdom, and for each other.” I thought about translating it on screen, and then I decided that I didn’t want to take you out of it.

Photo: Ilze Kitshoff/Sony Pictures

The cast you’ve assembled delivers on every demand this movie makes, but I was particularly blown away by your young lead, Thuso Mbedu. You didn’t know that she was capable of carrying the movie.

I knew she was the one as soon as I saw her, but my hesitation was… I thought she was 16. I hadn’t seen Thuso in anything. She was definitely a leading actress. Underground Railroad, but it hadn’t come out yet. Barry [Jenkins]His casting is flawless. So, I was curious.

I knew I wanted our cast to be a balance of everybody from all over — African-Americans and South Africans and West Africans and Londoners. So it was. [casting Thuso, a South African actor]This was my chance to find the right balance. But it’s chops first: “Who is best for the role?” And as Soon as she came up on my screen — because it was Zoom auditions, which was so hard — she leapt through. It was clear that I cared deeply about her. Her actions were subtle and different from others. I could see her mind working in her reactions, but not in the way an actor “working.” Everything felt real in the moment.

Photo: Stewart Cook/Sony Pictures

Viola Davis knew exactly what Nanisca was, as well as the emotional and physical arc of Nanisca. The Queen of WomenShould continue to take care of her. What happened to this relationship when you began to tackle the same material together?

Viola kept a notebook full of her backstory. Although such information is best left to an actor, Viola shared her backstory with me and the other actors. It is a great way to get some knowledge and incorporate that information into my writing.

The thing Viola brought that was not in the script, and it was such an obvious thing — two days before we were starting to shoot, we were in rehearsal, and she said, “Why are we hiding the fact that I’m 56 years old? I’m 56.” In the script we were saying that she was younger, and not dealing with the reality — and why not? She’s an aging warrior. You have to ask yourself questions about everything in your life. “Is what I put my body through, my mind through, worth it? How can I have an impact on this kingdom?” And it was ultimately to push for change. That was what she decided to do. That’s where the moment in the baths came from, where she’s feeling her shoulder. It’s natural that she will ache from battle. That’s the beautiful thing about Viola, she has no vanity. [She’ll do]Whatever is most beneficial for your character.

You want actors that are not trained to do action work to be able to deliver such forceful performances to the camera.

It was amazing training. It started with me telling Viola and then all the other actors, “You’re going to be doing your own fighting and stunts.” It’s just better action.

What did you know? The Old Guard?

Absolutely. You can find more information here. The Old GuardMy bathroom battle in was my model. M:I6It is one of the great fights. Knowing what it means to be successful takes more effort. [the person doing the fighting] is really the actor, to get the performance in every moment — that really taught me a lot. So in The Old Guard, that’s what we focused on.

Because of this, it was quite different. [only]Lashana hadn’t done anything like this before. So how do I get a group of women who hadn’t done anything on this level near to the point where I can trust them with the action, and an audience can fully believe them? This was quite a leap. Danny Hernandez was the one I met. An Old Guard, he was my fight coordinator — he was my second call, because I saw the way he worked with actors. He inspires and trusts them implicitly.

We talked about how we couldn’t fit them in our box. Six days per week and two times daily, the training began months ago. It was the hardest thing they’d ever done. The rehearsal was part of building character. This is how you change your body and mind. They were athletes. They were warriors. It was a bonding experience that they shared as they went through the same hell. This is the kind of sisterhood we created [in training]It appeared onscreen.

Photo: Sony Pictures

The cultural diversity of Dahomey allowed you to think differently about action in comparison to the contemporary environment of The Old Guard?

This is what I was referring to Braveheart,However Slumdog MillionaireIt was also a model. It was a movie I saw that took me to a different world. It didn’t push me away — it drew me in. This gave me confidence as I wanted the audience to feel similar about my story and these women.

Their weapons were, first and foremost, works of art. The Fowler Museum was a great place to visit. [at UCLA]The archives had material from Dahomey before filming began. To see these weapons and the designs… everything in the movie was mimicked from the real weaponry. The spear was not available in that era, so it was only hand-tohand combat. It was all about showing men how women could beat them and bringing their intensity to the table. [So we included] the fact that they use their nails, that they would soak them in brine to harden them, file them into points — that was a weapon. Palm oil on the skin so their opponents couldn’t grab hold of them — that was a weapon.

And then there’s the violence the Agojie put themselves through to train. The obstacle course training sequence, where the women race through a trench full of brambles and razor-sharp branches was how you filmed it. It was rough.

[The Agojie]That was the third time I went through it. We didn’t have that much screen time.

Because I was certain that the audience had to be convinced, it was hard to find out how to film this. And I couldn’t send my actors through it, even though some would have been willing to. However, everything outside the camera was authentic and the interior was made of brambles. They used 3D to build all those brambles, so I was always shooting through real brambles, and it tricks the audience’s mind.

The Queen of Women It also serves as an honest portrait of African slavery. Was it difficult to match Hollywood’s glamour with such a blunt portrayal of slavery?

This was something that I felt we had to expose. Almost every society engaged in slavery in some respect, and the difference here, prior to Europeans coming — as in any other type of society, it was about prisoners of war. Never commerce — that’s what Europeans brought to it. However, we set this movie at the crossroads of the kingdom and Ghezo was being forced to decide. [whether to capture other Africans and sell them to European slavers].

Because it was literally — half the kingdom wanted to abolish their involvement, and the other half wanted to keep it, because it brought them wealth. Ghezo made that choice, as Nanisca was represented by the Agojie. America certainly has. [Black people are]We are taught that America’s existence begins with slavery. We’re not taught that we came from so far beyond that. This knowledge can really make a difference. So I’m hoping, foremost, you go and you’re entertained, and you have fun with the film, but you get to see yourself reflected in a way you never have, and change your mindset.

To that point, there’s a scene in the film where Izogie braids Nawi’s hair, as the two have a heart-to-heart about being Agojie. This scene reminded me of a similar moment in the first film between Sanaa and Regina Hall. Love & Basketball. Even framing seemed like echo. Is that conscious or does this speak to something more?

You said it was impossible to connect the two. In the original script, Izogie brought a bracelet to Izogie. Knowing how important hair was, knowing how connective braiding one’s hair can be, I felt like that was a more interesting way to do the scene, so I changed to that. Lashana was very grateful for this scene. She said she’s always wanted to play a scene like that, because that’s what she does in real life with her nieces. And yeah, there’s just a beauty in the quietness… what they’re talking about is women who want to be great, be the best. That is what I love. Seemingly it’s a contrast. Braiding your hair is a feminine idea. Being great does not have to be feminine. I hope a throughline in my work is redefining “female” and femininity.

Photo: Ilze Kitshoff/Sony Pictures

In the last 10 years, there has been a lot of discussion in cinematography about lighting Black skin properly, particularly dark skin. It’s been so mishandled over the last century. This was a discussion you had with Polly Morgan, your DP?

It was huge. Going in, the first conversation I had with Polly is that we needed to light our women better than they’ve ever looked before. Because there’s been an absolute history of Black actors being lit horribly. Right before we shot this film — I’m not gonna say the movie, but one of our actors was in a huge movie with a very respected director and a very respected DP in a very respected studio, and you could not see her in some scenes. To me, it was very offensive. How could you go through this entire process, not seeing what I’m seeing? Offensive. I told Polly, “This can never happen in this film. It’s idiotic.” And so that was absolutely every day, “How do they look? Are we honoring these women and showing their beauty, or shooting them beautifully?” And Polly did.

Have you ever thought about making a movie like this? It would have been possible.

Absolutely. That was my goal early on in my career. The industry hadn’t caught up to me yet. It had been a while since the doors were open, especially in the space of women’s action. And it wasn’t until Wonder WomanPatty’s success story [Jenkins]a first-class experience that opened up the doors. [Pitching those types of movies earlier in my career] wasn’t even an option.

Before I ever did the Marvel Cloak and dagger pilot [in 2017], I shifted my thinking from “I wish I could do that” to “I’m going to do that.” And then it was Okay, now how can I plan this for this industry?It is necessary to be able to enter the door. It all started with the pilot and it got me to the discussion. Because it’s Marvel that led me to [Sony and Marvel’s Silver Sable and Black Cat movie] Black and Silver. This script I was able to repair. It took me a year to fix that script. That would have been so cool. It’s an incredible disappointment, because I came in so specifically with my pitch and never wavered. However, there was still some hesitation and we will continue where it is. [I felt] like, I don’t think this is gonna get made.To save my sanity, I decided to quit. However, I realized that the project was no longer what I wanted. Black and SilverTo be displayed in The Old Guard.

It’s a big deal to walk away from something like that. And there’s a part of me that was like, You don’t walk away from something like that. But I realized I wasn’t happy, and I saw the writing on the wall. Patty and I also had a great conversation. She was at an event that I attended and she just started talking to me about the time when she left an opportunity. [to direct Thor: The Dark World]. Then, right around the corner appeared Wonder Woman. So it was about having the courage to walk away if you’re not seeing that you can do your best work in an environment. The end was good. [Sony Pictures CEO]Tom Rothman. Also, when? The Queen of Women There was trust when it came up.

You’ve evolved into a bit of a journeyman director who can’t be defined by one type of movie, which is less and less common today. So this question is even more exciting: What’s next for you? What’s your next big challenge?

It’s been four years nonstop, because The Old GuardI went straight into The Queen of Women. However, I’m faced with two different projects and must choose between them. There’s one really big one that’s set up… I’ll just say it’s in space.

We love space.

It is my goal to place us in all genres. Disrupt genre. It’s an incredible story based on an incredible short story. And then the other is, after these two big movies, I’ve been wanting to write a story that’s been in my head for four years now, a more personal story going back to where it started.

There’s a lot of talk about The Queen of Women It is the movie studios who rarely risk their money. Was it high-stakes or easy? Was it the film everyone wanted?

Because the actors believed in the vision implicitly, and they trusted me completely, the pressure on me was immense. I also had to deliver the goods. And doing something that hadn’t been done before, that’s exciting. But it’s also scary. To have the response we’ve gotten from it is everything you would hope for as an artist. It is understood by people and they respond.